LAWSUITS , Alcoholics Anonymous, Sexual assault, Rape, Sexual Harassment, Your Rights, Non Profits and Stopping a 1930’s Institution from Getting away with Murder.

truth justice

We want to begin a new dialogue about how to expose the coercion of US citizens who get DUI’s, and told they must go to AA meetings, which is a violation of their First Amendment Rights. We want to  stop AA from being in our Courts and educate people about other free options like SMART RECOVERY, Moderation, SOS, Women for Sobriety and HAMS Harm Reduction and the Use of Naltrexone etc.

We want AA out of The FAA and extorting Pilots to go to AA meetings,  to AA rehabs to the tune of 40K a month because they have money, and forcing them to spend thousands of dollars to go to an AA Psychiatrist. Yes an AA member who is a psychiatrist and playing the AA game and making alot of money doing it.

We want to stop The Board of Nursing from sending Nurses to AA for 5 years.

We want AA members, or those coerced there to know that when they are sexually harassed in an AA meeting, that they have rights and they can do something about it.

There have been similar organizations that have gotten away with sexual assault crimes and preying on children for hundreds of years, that have since been attacked, sued and forced to change . These organizations were once untouchable. The Catholic Church and The Boy Scouts have helped many, yet still they needed to address sex offenders and deviants from using their organization for easy pickings. It was their Insurance carriers , not their caring about the protection of children that forced them to do this.

With the growth of the internet and a few powerful blogs like Orange Papers and Stinkin- Thinkin, things began to change in regards to AA and secrecy.

In 2008 a General Service Board member , Paul C.  wrote a 7 page letter http://stinkin-thinkin.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/07/ATTACHMENT_TO_TOPIC_002-PREDATORS.doc.pdf  to the General Service Board of Alcoholics Anonymous. They made him wait one year to read it to them. Then something happened that shocked not only Paul, but a couple of Board members … one that I interviewed for The 13th Step. They were shocked when the board asked the AA member team of paid employees to go to the AA US fellowship and ask them how they feel about such things.

They told the Board ” That’s not our job! ” The men that I knew who were inside for that meeting told me that after my 8 page letter arrived in October of 2009 they, the AA General Service Board voted to do nothing…. One man was in AA for 30 + years. These are really good men who were sickened by what they saw going in in NY AA Main Headquarters…these men who were on the board decided to leave AA .

All across America, including Los Angeles, Ohio, Fort Collins, Louisville , Kentucky, Bellingham ,Washington, I visited AA meetings with women who were harmed and we saw a pattern. Meetings once filled to capacity over with 300 now had 30. Meetings once filled with 110 pp, on a Friday  night , now had 10.

With one click into Google  a person can type, IS AA DANGEROUS. or Sexual Predators in AA.

Gabrielle Glasers New York Times Bestseller, HER BEST KEPT SECRET http://gabrielleglaser.com/

and Lance Dodes book The SOBER TRUTH    http://www.lancedodes.com/ also came out in the summer of 2012. Gabrielle’s piece in THE ATLANTIC had millions of reads and thousands of comments. http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2015/04/the-irrationality-of-alcoholics-anonymous/386255/

Most journalists I spoke to at first had no idea that AA was not run by a trained social worker or therapist. I was shocked by their idea that it was. I knew what AA was and what it wasn’t.

Then CBS 48 Hours aired. Boy did the shit storm happen on CBS 48 Hours FACEBOOK Page- Some AA members calling Maureen Maher all kinds of vicious names and comments that even shocked some of us. They went crazy calling Karla Brada parents names saying they were looking for Big bucks with their Law Suit against AA, which we know is not true. EVEN Marianne Williamson attacked Gabrielle Glaser on her FACEBOOK page when Gabrielle was on MSNBC. She was far from “spiritual” in her remarks.

If you are leaving AA, NA, or if you have left and have been harmed in any way, I would like to make a suggestion. Write your story of how and what happened in the shortest form  you can do. Think about anyone who is a professional in your town, be it a Therapist, Police Officer, Judge, Doctor, Lawyer, Educator, parole Officer. Tell your community how you were harmed.

#2. If what was done to you was a crime. Think about — are you willing to take them to court, finally go to the Police? Do you need help with support to do that? contact us at makeaasafer@gmail.com

#3 Were you “just” sexually harassed and are you willing to speak out about it?

#4 Were you financially ripped off by an AA member or your AA sponsor ?

Maybe you just want to make a youtube video about it.  Like Jason Bartley has done.

There are many who silently Hate AA. There are many who claim AA saved their lives. We here know what AA really is…and what it isn’t.

2016 – Get ready as we are ready to kick some butt when it comes to extortion, The FAA,  the Board of Nursing, DUI and coercion in our courts.

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98 thoughts on “LAWSUITS , Alcoholics Anonymous, Sexual assault, Rape, Sexual Harassment, Your Rights, Non Profits and Stopping a 1930’s Institution from Getting away with Murder.

  1. When I read the comment sections at the end of anti, or just AA questioning articles online; the AA people are either horrifically nasty, or maybe what should be considered even more of a red flag (since internet assholes are common) is the AA-ease. Mainstream people accept the special language the intensely indoctrinated AA people use when, I believe, they would be pointing that out as “strange” were it coming from some other source that’s not supposed to be a religion. I hope people actually pause to hear what that talk really sounds like, and the passive-aggressive, circular thinking it represents.

  2. But the Bradas were after a monetary judgment. It is in John Noland’s amended complaint for damages. Not one request for change.

  3. She won’t stop until she takes her last breath – or so she reckons. It’s really sad and lonely to end up thinking you can destroy something that has done so much good in helping to save the lives of genuine alcoholics who never want to drink again. Sure there are other paths and people should be encouraged to be knowledegable of what is on offer but to try and bring down a method of free recovery is something that anyone with any sanity will never encourage or support.

  4. Interesting comments… I also happen to think that very few people in the world give a damn about people who got into trouble with alcohol. Most folks I know say it is self inflicted and therefore are firmly against any kind of aid for alcoholics unless it is free and they are not paying for it in their taxes. Just one reason why AA has survived 80 years I guess because members fund it themselves. They don’t accept donations from outside.

  5. Trolls are trolling on this thread, I see.

    AA is in a “bubble”, the organization and its devout members. Court-ordered AA meeting attendance helps AA keep its number-churn going. The courts win because it doesn’t take any money to send someone to AA. The defendants will conform or be put in jail. AA gets the numbers, even if just for a little while; and they buy the literature, and the literature money is what keeps AA World Services going.

    I’ve known a lot of wonderful people in AA, in some ways I still consider myself a member, good human beings in the organization helped me a lot when I first stopped drinking. Drinking isn’t something I can handle and I’m glad to have given it up.

    The dark side is that in AA, the victim is generally viewed as at fault; whether they were sexually harassed or abused, or taken advantage of financially. I’ve seen both over the years, and the victims get addressed with the “what’s your part?” line to simply shut them up. If someone disagrees with any part of the program, it is viewed as “sick”.

    Why did GSO refuse to even allow some kind of warning statement to be read at the beginning of meetings? AA is so active in recruiting from the jails and prisons that it seems the least they could do. But then, if something never appears directly in any of the literature there is plausible deniability.

    I believe the Brada’s are doing the right thing in suing AA, attention needs to be brought to this problem precisely because AA doesn’t seem to give a damn about people being hurt in its “rooms”.

    AA has a really bad success rate. I know the “it worked for me” crowd got theirs, so it must work “if you work it”; I disagree. By appearance it “worked” for me, and the fellowship did work for me, and I “worked” the steps, which made me acceptable to the fellowship. In the long run though, the self-deprecation of the steps has taken a toll on me emotionally. The lingo and the thought-stopping sayings erode human compassion. There’s no compassion for the Brada family in most of the posts here. No compassion for people who are harmed within the fellowship. And a lot of anger directed at Massive for daring to speak out. I remember the fear I felt when I read an article in the Grapevine about 15 years or so ago written by a woman who had left AA, and stayed sober through her Church. It scared me that she could stay sober, then I got really pissed off that she wasn’t still going to meetings, what a betrayal!!!! But mostly I was scared it might not be true that all who stop going to meetings face only jails, institutions, and DEATH.

    • So any family who loses a family member and feels that another party shares some responsibility, and therefor sues them, is wanting only money and notoriety? How about letting a court of law decide?

      • Don’t be stupid border collie, your argument holds no water. You can sue till ever after but unless blame is there you ain’t getting nothing.

        • It would be good to look up frivolous litigation. Just because it was dropped doesnt mean it was wrong let alone being motivated by money power or prestige which is actually what is being mooted by many and is a typical response. It had merit for it to be able to be heard in the first place and after the hearing aaws etc they were absolved of any charges.

        • That’s not what I wrote. If someone sues an entity because they feel that entity had some responsibility in a loved one’s death, that does not make that family greedy or wanting only notoriety. It doesn’t matter if they win or lose, a law suite on behalf of a loved one does not mean they have poor character.

    • Well put Border Collie and your correct there are a lot of closed minded trolls on this blog. I guess their too brainwashed to think for themselves anymore or see anything outside their little box otherwise known as the rooms of AA. Fact-I was taken advantage of by AA. They have been very secretive and dishonest with the public about the truth of their program. I was referred to a 12-Step program by a former addict turned drug abuse counselor and only had the words of my AA brainwashed brother and hers to go by and the false image the media presents of the program. I checked myself in only to be brainwashed, lied to, and ripped off by a bunch of jerks making a descent living feeding people a bunch of bull. AA didn’t save my life. With help from God, I saved myself. I don’t have a disease, I am not powerless, and today I refuse to act like some kind of a victim. I turned to rehab and AA when I needed a lot of help because of so many recent losses in my life, which led to severe depression and also led me to begin a 11 month journey into abusing alcohol. I had not drank in 30 years. I needed help with severe depression, rehab helped me absolutely 0% and AA managed to worsen my depression. I’m thankful I figured this lie of a program out within another 11 months. Today I drink in moderation only, I am no longer depressed because I got the real help I needed. I know all you devout AA goers will say, then you never must have never been an alcoholic to begin with, which is one of you guys favorite excuses when someone is able to successfully drink in moderation. I do believe the severe withdrawals that put me in the hospital were real when I originally quit before entering rehab. I was addicted physically and mentally, but no longer do I believe it’s a disease. I don’t recommend everyone try moderation because not everyone has the needed willpower, but many have proven that moderation is an alternative. As for the trolls, this blog is for people who are anti-AA, people who have been harmed by the program and need a place to vent. We are people who may have been harmed financially, sexually, physically, emotionally, etc….and, No, AA did not save our lives. As a matter of fact, in my case it came really close to taking it, literally. “Some must die so that others may live” and telling people “It’s jails institutions and death” if you ever drink again is a dangerous lie and a perfect example of something you would hear in a cult, which in the case of this program makes sense. Until you trolls have been hurt by a program that you were sent to that was supposed to help you and instead did the opposite, I’m sure there are plenty of pro-AA brainwashing sites for you guys complete with all your favorite AA slogans and sayings that I’m sure you can never get enough.

  6. So todays lesson in errant trolling is the use of gaslighting and what is known as cyberstalking. Anyone can match up the comments made today to the above known techniques of abuse. It is sadly not very subtle but continues to confirm the cult like qualities of certain people. Thanks everyone if that is indeed the case. Now what about sock puppets online. Yep some people even try and pretend to be someone else..how mad is that

  7. AA has grown to be a major part of society, arguably larger than many churches and certainly more active. It has problems that have evolved out of changing human interaction; meth and ecstasy users for example probably weren’t wandering into AA in 1930. When it started Pot was a felony, now its at the corner store. Human sexual behavior also trends. In the 30’s there weren’t many women attending, those who were got treated differently. How did people act in AA during the Women’s Liberation movement of the 60’s or the sexual revolution? AA has refused to change so that it fits society; to its detriment the antiquated literature is considered to be divinely inspired. The founders and figureheads are all worshiped in a way; there are parts of the whole that have become sick. To the point: while lawsuits can be ridiculous frivolous and cruel, they also cause deeper examination of policy. AA isn’t the only method available to treat addiction in the 21st century. Aren’t courts already making other options available? In nature where we live, if something doesn’t adapt it dies; this is known as the immutable law.
    Nothing on earth can be made immune to harm, yet no one can find anything that still exists that has not adapted for its own survival. AA will adapt or die.

    • SMART has its own program for offenders and regularly encourages those incarcerated to get well through that. I don’t know what others are doing.

    • But in the ways that Monica wants to argue, AA doesn’t need to adapt. What she is forgetting to include when she says her 9 page letter in 2009ended up roundfiled is because it was determined that each group can add whatever statements deigned necessary. Seems to me that they DID address her letter and found that the traditions had it handled since 1955.

      There is a kernel of truth to just about everything Monica attempts to address. Yet she is deceiving people. In her movie, I understand she tries to depict herself as something AA fears, which is why no one comes down from the office to talk with her on film. The fact is that they address no one. She counts on an ignorant public to not know that yet people within the fellowship do.

        • If you don’t like paraphrasing then read it for yourself on AA.org.

          You can bet if the suit had been successful, the decisions would all be here so people could read them.

      • I was once ignorant too of what AA really does, I thought they were a safe place with professionals. But then I learned that AA and NA are full of pedophiles, rapists, wife beaters, thief’s and every other known dangerous criminal known to man. It is a fact that no one is too dangerous for AA or NA. They will accept ANYBODY!

        Thanks to the brave and courageous Monica, both AA and NA are being exposed for the dangerous cult that they are. I am deeply grateful for all of her hard work and perseverance on the very important cause.

        I have seen the movie and it is excellent! It exposes AA on so many issues. They create a perfect storm for criminal activity against women, children and men too.

        Thanks Monica! You are awesome!

        • Here is what one blogger troll wrote- “Who cares if they have a list of people who send money? So does the Red Cross. Because I sent money doesn’t make me an employee.”

          Well lets see — first of all you are not going to Red Cross meetings holding hands with strangers , chanting crap from 1935, or are we sitting in Red Cross meetings being told ” who you hear here, and what you hear here, and who you see here let it stay here” as if AA has some special blanket of above the law pass….nor is a court ordering you to a non existent red cross meeting.

          IN fact Red Cross has training and safety polices for its volunteers.

          If you are a VOLUNTEER you idiot! I did not even say employee , they all —those volunteers need to be trained in safety and sexual harassment in the work place.

          If every AA group is connected to its District, Area , Pacific region—– then NY Yes—– all those groups are connected. Top down. NY GSB decided without the vote of the fellowship to allow court ordering in 1989 in Florida where drug court began.

          AA has it own literature and monthly area meetings in Los Angeles and all over the country that are actively pursuing how they can get new members in Jail, in schools etc now they are going after seniors.

    • All of you AA’s are hypocrites. You say to be kind, tolerant. And you do none of those things.

      You will see in the near future AA go down. Cry, curse, bully all you want. Because you are just putting more nails in your coffins.

      Bye bye AA! And I’m loving it. You’ve got so much rope you will hang yourselves.

  8. These crazy steppers are really showing how well the program works, lol. Oh they are so spiritual, lol. They need to call their sponsors and hit some mtgs imho…

    • You assume a lot genx and it all gets very boring – throwing around the words “stepper” and “meetings” like some kind of indoctrination you learned in the AA hate speak camp. It’s indicative of the anti recovery movement brainwashing, now that really is negative and can do no-one any good. It’s lose, lose all the way.

      • Lol brainwashing nice switch John jeez you are so predictable.

        So todays troll lesson

        Switch it round and allege that the acusser is brainwashed. Assuming of course that genx isnt actually in a cult like John thinks he is lol jeez you guys are funny

        Poor poor argument

      • I’m no longer brainwashed. It’s you and AA who have their own language. You silly silly brainwashed, ignorant, twisted minion….LMAO. Oh and you’re a bully too! This is an leaving AA site, why are all you trolls here? I don’t see any of you living happy productive lives. Why does massive bother you so much. You seem very angry. I would advise doing a 4th step and you also owe all of us on this site an apology….if you’re working a good program that’s what you would do….think about it.

        • Ok so you’ve made the point you were trying to make. So bye now. We’re here bc we have left AA or are leaving. You’re presence is not really appreciated here.

        • Because AA is not working for them. They might not be using, but their behaviors are very sick. Hopefully they will go and get help somewhere else, where they can become decent kind humans. Because they sure are not learning it in AA. Another reason I hate AA. Full of hypocrites, and very mean, hateful people. KKK is a good comparison to AA.

  9. I read your article – if you think anyone posting on this public forum is a troll because they don’t agree with you why do you engage them out of the wood Stove? Your article says this is to be avoided so perhaps it is YOU that needs to have the last word. Pardon me for butting in!

    • Yes thatz right I do. You describe me as predictable then thats okay i shall predictable. Now i shall say you are naive to think that anyone doesnt understand that aaws got off as it were we do know this. Secondly over time it has become patently obvious to anyone with half a brain that there is a consistent measured use of trolling on this website and sorry but it is more than just disagreement. It is consistent with the concept of trolling and if you take some time to look back across the different threads then it is clear that this is what is happening. Stinkin thinkin and other sites attract this kind of attention just because people are expressing an opinion towards what is invariably a very skewed quasi religeous faith healing program approach that just so happens to not work for a heck of a lot of people. As such the more wayward participants have to think they can draw on silly techniques to attempt to disrupt this and other sites.

      As I maintain it seems that trolling seems to the preferred method to achieve this aim which is futile of course as it reenforces all that we say anyway. It also includes persistent ad hominen attacks etc etc on the owner and otherwise over and over again. This particular group finds the shallow victory as a stick to beat about. Ironically accusing the owner of the same thing. It could have been much more respectful to all to have the temerity to treat it magnanimously but no. Which says a lot.

      So yes i will post if i feel i want to predictable or otherwise it is just an opinion and i will also point out that it is pointless trolling away. Sorry if you dont like it and thanks for butting in.

    • What people are doing is trying to put in a call for decency. How can you possibly be rallying people for legal action without disclosing that the case you thought was such a cinch couldn’t have been more quickly roundfiled. For years, the Bradas’ life has been consumed by the assurances that AA was wrong and they would prevail. The sole person providing the information was Monica, however distorted it might be. It’s verifiable. All of these things are available and people make them available on their blogs as it costs money to get the documents through the court website. Ask John Noland if he will ever take another case against AA, especially on contingency. I bet he cannot wait until April when this is all over for him.

  10. Todays troll lessons..

    Using the truth to beat a stick over the object of the obsessive mind. Flooding the thread with facts that mean little to anyone in the wider scheme of things. Switching which was pointed out yesterday. Concern trolling by ‘sincerely’ wishing the blog owner well but then proceeding to have at the owner anyway. Creating falsehoods in order to negate challenges.

    So transparent and a signifint lack of class from the mega troll.

    Sorry to be predictable. ?

    • You tend to say these thngs when you feel you are losing. You claimed it was a shallow victory for AA when Monica surely was counting on the victory and it would be huge. These remarks aren’t for you but for the many she claims read her blog. They might find more logic is the verdicts for themselves.

      That I wish Monica well in her health doesn’t seem to be in relationship with a disagreement over this subject. I am not negating challenges. I am presenting real and true information so that people can see for themselves. I still wish Monica well even if you find that distasteful.

  11. Also goes to show that freedom of information in the hands of certain people is really not a good thing. In this case it just perpetuates the rationale that the cultesque qualities of some members or not of aa seem to think it is fair game to trot it all out in a seeming skewed sense of justice. It is once again simply madness gone mad, but hey what do you expect. I feel for the Bradas I really do. This is called empathy its hard I know but it can be learned. Fake it till you make as they say. Or if anyone reading needs help then im sure there are people who are more than happy to describe it at least to get a basic working model of this concept if nothing else.

  12. Also the question remains exactly what does AA do to keep its members safe? despite the factoids all that can be assumed is still very little other than advice to be careful, stick with the winners or tell your sponsor. Not very effective methods at all particularly in respect of what happened if something is alleged. What then? who knows. The concept of institutional betrayal is all so apparent. Whistleblowing and solid procedures to address issues are clearly needed to prevent harm. Can AA meet this simple and effective mechanism that is evidence supported to reduce harm. On the current position it seems the answer is a resounding no and an opportunity moreover to window shop for more emperors new clothes.

    • Incorrect. This has been pointed out before to Dimitri. AAWS also oversees groups as well under the auspices of a yes a publishing company. Hardly well placed yobe delivering alchol recovrty methods.What next Marvel comics recovery? It is a conference approved piece of information.

          • The concerning thing for me is that you seem to think you are able to speak about Karlas parents simply based on some general public information. This is concerning that you are unable to discriminate words in a legal case to human motivation to two individuals you dont even know personally. Worrying behaviour this.

    • Or in my case I wasn’t even warned. I was a young girl left to care for myself. When I complained about being sexually harrassed I was told to look at my part and that it was the way I carried myself! When the old timer guru from California that was speaking at our meeting where I’m at in Washington leaned over and said he wishes I was sucking on him the way I was sucking on my diet coke I was drinking, the women who worshipped this fucking predator said I needed a better sense of humor. When the married old timer that was married convinced the women that he needed to be my sponsor and then he proceeded to tell me I could move in with him and his little AA stepford wife wouldn’t care and if I did he would buy me boobs. I fired him and when I told the women they said oh well you’re the one that got you in that mess. Yeah AA does a great job of protecting the young and vulnerable…

  13. I think it is time for people who have been sentenced to AA to start taping (with video) the shit that they see in meetings then bring it to the judge. Simple as that.

    (but this is only my personal opinion)

    Librarian

      • And this is clarabelle. There’s a special place in he’ll for women in AA that don’t want to make it safer and you old bag will be at the top of the list…

        • Clarabelle has nothing better to do than to troll good sites like this and try to tear them down. She has a real mental problem. Hopefully after we get AA shut down she might get some real help. She’s everywhere! Here, there, she’s everywhere, so beware.

    • Librarian- I think this is a great idea. ALso-

      people should ask before entering and paying big busks,,,” so is this rehab is a medical facility?, and who does your over site? Who is the governing Board of your counselors , etc. Are there background checks done of your drug treatment counselors. Maybe in some states but not in CA and PA> But still there is not a separate Board like if you are a Doctor, that is making sure you are getting heath care, mental health care or are you just getting a

      Wacko religious cult- self help[ untrained pods, from 1935 created by a narcissist and 13 stepper…

      Turns out out that The Health Department s in charge in California. NO Darn MEDICAL Board of any kind. So if you were being treated for a disease, wouldn’t that be fraud– illegal—a sham—?

      hey where the fake tonic sold by charlatans in the 1800- 1930’s? Oh yes — its called AA. With the US government stamp of approval.

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