SHAMELESS on SHOWTIME continues to pound its Narcotics Anonymous Propaganda


Dear John Wells- Writers and Producers- Show-runners of SHAMELESS on SHOWTIME-

Okay, we love the show-

From Fiona to Lip— I love this crazy ass family- Kevin’s Bar- Debbie getting pregnant and fighting to keep the baby – Bill Macy’s love affair with the dying cancer lady in last season…I cried– OMG I loved her — what an amazing actress- what a wonderful thread that was —-

but this NA character played by ( Dermot Mulroney)  and isn’t he 30 years older then Fiona ? —

So his character who was in NA when she met him has to call his f**king sponsor to ask him if he can sh*t or not…but you made Fiona out to be the predator— not—-likely—-in real NA culture.

Really —- guys— a 53 year old man, who has a kid, who runs a diner, has to ask a lay person who is untrained what to do ? NA and AA are not the only game in town, but even a great show like this where you wonder if the writers really like NA or not …

still they treat it like “sliced bread” …..aka “the only game in town”, which we know it’s not.

Like — when are you gonna bring the guns down and expose 12 step for the shit bag place it really is.

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46 thoughts on “SHAMELESS on SHOWTIME continues to pound its Narcotics Anonymous Propaganda

      • Yes here is a story about a female predator sent to AA-she cut up a guy and put him in her stew!

        Colorado Woman Dismembered Boyfriend Set Free and Sent to AA Meetings By Judge

        You really don’t know who you will be sitting next to in an AA or NA meeting. It could be a woman who dismembered her boyfriend and cut him up for stew!

        Jane Lynn Woodley pleaded insanity.The judge felt it is okay to send her to AA meetings where minors attend and other vulnerable members of society. I guess we are all vulnerable when it comes to sitting next to a murderer, right?

        Woman Who Pleaded Insanity Set Free.
        Saturday, 09-Apr-2005 10:50PM
        ALAMOSA, Colo., April 9 (UPI) — A woman found not guilty by reason of insanity of killing her boyfriend and mutilating his body has been set free in Alamosa, Colo.

        Jane Lynn Woodry was deemed ready for a supervised return to society by a judge after a two-hour hearing, the Rocky Mountain News reported Saturday.

        Woodry was found not guilty by reason of insanity in the 1993 first-degree murder of Peter Michael Greene. She shot him four times with a .25-caliber revolver, dismembered his body, wrapped his torso in a blanket, and stored it in a closet in his home.

        She took his legs back to her apartment, where she cut hunks of flesh from his legs. Investigators found bite-sized chunks of human flesh prepared in a stew on the stove at Woodry’s home.

        Conditions for her release also include holding a job, attending Alcoholics Anonymous meetings, writing daily diary cards and a journal for review by a social worker, and meeting with her case manager three times a week.

        “I want people to know that the community is safe”, Woodry said. “I am not a danger to the community.”

        – See more at:

        • When I read the comment on the 12 Step member who made her ex into a stew returning to 12 Step meetings, I have to admit that I was morbidly curious on how what type of meeting shares she gives.

          Indeed, it could make for highly entertaining black comedy to have this woman at the center of a more realistic vision of AA. It seems like its black comedy but the fact is that it is more realistic than the Pro AA Pro 12 Step propaganda that most shows are so freely doling out to the public nowadays.

  1. meh :\ heard ppl have had bad experiences with Na aswell and that the big book there is just as damaging if not more than aa big book…..

  2. I personally did not and do not, want to have contact with people who have violent pasts. Why would I? It’s not chic is just playing with danger.


      • Hi Nora, Thanks for responding. I found it cathartic to say I don’t want to have contact with violent criminals in my everyday life. I hope you feel that way too.


  3. I don’t pretend to know anything yet I have seen things.
    I go to NA and AA. What I’ve learned is that drugs and alcohol cause evil possession. Whether or not the Evil is a person or just an energy that tricks peoples minds the outcome is the same. I see it in everyone there. We are all like the moon with a dark side we show no one (Mark Twain.) The difference being that those with less clean time are closer to evil than those who have been putting up a fight and staying clean. Last night the meeting scared me. A newcomer fresh off Meth told me he was possessed by Satan and that he would succeed in having sex with one of the new Gay women in the room. Then he warned me; he showed me all the blog comments on line where people share their Meth induced demonic possession stories. Meth is the foolproof gate to evil. Use it regularly and you can be assured that you will see and speak with evil spirits. We are all subject to these human conditions in different degrees. When I tried moderate drinking after abstinence I clearly saw the evil creeping in. It happens right here on this blog when we become negative thinkers and find fault with everything; it is evils favorite trick. (Napoleon Hill, Outwitting the Devil.)
    I do like the article comments.
    “Really —- guys— a 53 year old man, who has a kid, who runs a diner, has to ask a lay person who is untrained what to do ?”
    – If its what the addict is willing to do then yes. Most of the people I see in NA are in serious desperate trouble.The people helping them are to a lesser degree in the grips of evil and potentially able to pull them in and escape death. Perhaps this is a waste of time, perhaps the sober member is just an agent for a different kind of evil. I don’t know yet I don’t like people to die in the grips of evil.
    “but this NA character played by ( Dermot Mulroney) and isn’t he 30 years older then Fiona ? —”
    Good point! Is the relationship sustainable? Is it selfish? Is it perhaps perverted?
    Whats the outcome? Cheating by either party with yet a younger person?
    And lastly… Is it propaganda? Whose propaganda is is and who would benefit from it? Whose fantasy is it? The director, The writer, the producer? Are they in NA?
    I am personally afraid to go back to NA, the evil is VERY strong and I could die there, I’ve been warned by the member.
    Will I hear it and trust my instinct?
    Or will I continue to go and possibly subject myself to his wrath.
    “Ne te quaesiveris extra.” (Do not seek for things outside of yourself)”
    ― Ralph Waldo Emerson, Self-Reliance and Other Essays

    • Emerson’s “Self Reliance” is a great antidote to the twelve-step farce. It’s a hard read due to the dated language, but it is spot on regarding how to fight the self negation demanded by the TSF.

      • I agree, its difficult to read Emerson!
        I prefer to listen to it, its much easier than the read.
        You can get it free by downloading the Librivox app and then downloading public domain books to be listened to off line.
        Or, the full essays are on YouTube.
        My favorites are Self Reliance, Compensation, and The Oversoul.
        I love inspirational books!

    • Hi ANON- I dont think drinking alcohol makes one evil- that s just brainwashed nonsense. I think the language you are using again is filled with stepper jargon. Why are yo going there again. Why dont you go to Smart online or Hams online in the chat room. WHy sit with such sick “evil” as you say energy? Why not develop some healthy habits and hobbies ?

      Now about a certain population who is using meth- the couple who murdered TRACY WHITE in downtown LA was into Vampire Ritual Abuse. With drinking blood and sh***t— Holy fucking God I could not believe some of the testimony in court which I sat in day after day….they were soooooo evil. What they did to TRACY. The killer ….He was using meth I think — he called himself an addict like he OWNED it like he had gone to NA meetings. He most certainly did. SO I agree about this new drug addict population. Making NA even more dangerous.

      • Hi M
        Things got real bad for me after trying abstinence. It wasn’t so much that drinking made things bad as drinking made bad things really bad.
        I had to “reel myself in” mentally because I was so sad; I was willing to do anything to get positive again.
        Inspirational books helped a lot (and I read quite a few that AA ripped of parts of for their program.) The books helped quite a bit. I don’t mind AA lite so much, but NA really scares me. I can see how easy it would be for me to get killed in there. I’ve got about seven months and I’m thinking I’ll cut back on NA. There is no way I’ll do the steps, Ive told them that, it’s a bit disrespectful to the party line; I’ve been warned. AA didn’t invent evil, they just repackaged it.
        If you point out the stepper jargon perhaps I can point you toward real literature where it originated. Read the classic New Thought books from the 30’s. Napoleon Hill, Outwitting The Devil, Think and Grow Rich, Carnegie How to Win Friends, Emerson(1840), Mary Baker Eddy, Phineas Quimby (1840), etc. I’ve come to the conclusion that great spiritual leaders use religion to personify natural phenomenon and the laws of the universe. These semantics make it impossible for many logical minds to accept. Inexplicable natural phenomenon is all around us, religion is just one way for humans to grasp the rules. Meth Vampires drinking blood? Evil? Cause and Effect? Nature? Call it what we will, the outcome was on the negative side of things. To the families who lost their loved ones it may be Satan Him/Herself. I wont argue with them.
        Go to one NA meeting in your neighborhood. You’ll be a lot safer knowing what lurks in the shadows just outside your door. Go with your husband and don’t shower.

        • hi Anon- no thanks about going to any NA or even AA meeting even for research anymore. I wasted enough years. But …I am glad you are ok .

          I already read those books. I marked up Think and Grow Rich when I was 22 and worked in selling Time Shares in Hawaii. All that Positive thinking stuff I have read it all. I hated the negativity that lurked in AA even in the 1970’s.

          I will quote you here “You’ll be a lot safer knowing what lurks in the shadows just outside your door.”

          WOW ….there are no NA meetings near my door now….thank GOD .

          “AA didn’t invent evil, they just repackaged it.”— great line anon=—–

          yes I do know that AA and Bill ripped off many books- but then AA members got sober and wrote books without revealing they were in AA. That was the self help era of the 70’s/ That bled into the early 80’s….Drug Court began, Rehab grew in grew to millions and now a billion dollar Industry that dumped millions into AA and the rest is history.

          A history I hope to change.

          SO anon—why don’t you use Smart and/or Hams online meetings and chats and those programs since you know about all of this if those meetings are not available in your town?

          • I think I remember now, it’s As A Man Thinketh,
            James Allen.
            I am addicted to AA, I get a (sick?) satisfaction from it.
            Thank You M.

            • Actually I think its Dale Carnegie that sounds so much like AA; parts of it are word for word. My jargon is lightweight M. Today I sat through half an AA meeting and heard the real True Believers. You will never hear me say “the solution is in the steps” or “this is a cure for all of Man’s ills”. I am officially “too smart for the program”. That is if you equate smart with evidence, reasoning and education.
              I allow myself to go to AA because I like the people; some of them are very nice. My program has two steps; don’t drink because I don’t like what it does to me and embrace consciousness and learning through spiritual pursuits and education. I don’t need any program other than working things out for myself.
              “Ne te quaesiveris extra.” (Do not seek for things outside of yourself)”

    • Is it propaganda? Whose propaganda is is and who would benefit from it? Whose fantasy is it? The director, The writer, the producer? Are they in NA?

      I am wondering the same thing. Who is the stepper….a writer ?

  4. The actual drugs and the alcohol are inanimate non concious chemical substances all naturally occurring at one point or another over millennia. It is only man made notions of good and evil that create false dilemma’s. Hope this helps.

  5. Then what about positive and negative electricity?
    Positive and negative Protons and Electrons?
    Positive and negative thought?
    And so on…
    Isn’t positive and negative our very nature by virtue of our make up?
    I’m open to your thoughts.

    • Plus, is the conflict false? Or is the conflict (dilemma) part of our nature.
      What about Higgs Boson?
      Symmetry vs. Chaos
      We are made of this fabric, isn’t it our nature?
      I’m interested in your theory, you seem very scientifically grounded.

      • Have you listened to Thicht nhat hahn on youtube lot’s of good stuff there. I do get where you are coming from anon, I like the scientific as well as the spiritual, each lends itself well to one another. Without science we would not know how we learn about god and vice versa, its not hard when it gets simplified. 🙂

        • I will listen to Thicht nhat hahn and sincerely appreciate the recommendation. I too embrace the Buddhist consciousness. Right now I’m listening to Darwin’s Origin of the Species. I’ll probably only be able to do an hour or so before I reach my limit. I’ll get to it later today and let you know how I like it.

            • I have listened to the Thicht nhat hahn interview with Oprah,
              I just did not remember until I went back to it. The MLK and the self ignition stories are quite moving.
              Is there a particular video that is a favorite of yours.
              As far as my comment regarding my limited knowledge of him my impressions were very positive.
              I am quite far from his inner peace. However, chanting and embracing Buddhism has served me well.
              My mind has a tendency to dwell on negative fears and make me very uncomfortable. When I am unable to to change my thoughts chanting helps.
              That is really all I know about it.

              • Okay then that is as good as it is based on that. Good luck and I hope you find the answers you are looking for.

      • I think you are over thinking it all way too much anon— just get away from those people and hang with more positive folks…..Dont ya think?

            • Generally the subject of people leaving aa isn’t exactly going to be all bells and dancing. Particularly as often times the more culty memebers have a seeming obsession with posting here. The only thing it achieves is making AA more cult like. Afterall for simplicity’s sake it is just a bout getting out of AA afterall, some people just can’t handle it.

              Life is great since leaving and I would recommend it to anyone who is having doubts. just make sure you get some support if needs be. I am grateful to the wierdo cultist section of AA’s troll mill here as it reminds me of just why I left and we get to help keep them sober so everyones a winner. This is very positive.

            • Why pro or anti? I don’t really care but what does alarm me is your approach to this. You are self-defeating with your extreme views. You seem a small group in a bubble of anger and that is not healthy – for anyone.

              • I know you have addressed your question to Frisco but I have been reading through this site and felt although I don’t like AA I don’t hate it obsessively like you guys seem to.

              • Nora- @ Self defeating— like AA?
                This thread is talking about even a great show like Shameless is shamelessly bringing NA into the episode like its the only game in town. Get It?

                Nora, Now move along. I would not write on a blog I didn’t like. Even AA meetings I didn’t like I would not go back to . I went where I liked the people, as hard as that became in the end. The same is true of Blog etiquette

                • If you weren’t so hostile Massive I would have discussed why I don’t like AA with the other person. Never mind, I am gone.

                  • To be fair i dont think it was hostile what massive wrote and really also all the psych analysis in your posts was unnecessary and largely wrong too. All sounded a bit steppy in new yorky type thingy

                  • NORA-SO you don’t hate it the way we do… but you feel inclined to judge us in your stepper sh**T kind of way …..really ____

                    don’t let the door hit you on the ass on the way out !!! 🙂

        • I so agree Massive: Over think and over analyze EVERYTHING. I dont think any sane person wants to “continually” do that for the rest of their lives; especially if your sober. If you enjoy it; “keep going back”. I look at and analyze myself at times. However, when i was in AA, I started to loose trust in my own very good judgement; until I lost all respect for their convoluted opinions. AA has reinvented the meaning of spirituality, responsibility, compassion, etc. I found no common sense in their dogma.

  6. Nora,

    This is just the internet. I believe there are those who dont agree with whats being said, so they just stay away. Then there are those who dont agee with what other say; yet they try to influence them. I have never contributed to a pro aa site; because it would be a waist of my precious time. Seems AA is good for others but Im not on the fence about it. I dont like it and IMO the negative definitely out ways the positive. If I decide to contribute to this site and express my negative opinion; it’s because I have the freedom to do just that.

  7. Nora, Just a little reminder:

    The slogan “Live and Let Live” can be extremely helpful when we are having trouble tolerating other people’s behavior. We know for certain that nobody’s behavior – no matter how offensive, distasteful or vicious – is worth the price of a relapse. Our own recovery is primary, and while we must be unafraid of walking away from people or situations that cause us discomfort, we must also make a special effort to try to understand other people – especially those who rub us the wrong way. Can I accept the fact, in my recovery, that it is more important to understand than to be understood?

  8. Massive, I was trying to fair and point out one of the positive slogans in AA and the Big Books interpretation. (:

    I guess everyone cant be expected to work a perfect program.

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